Yep. While we can all agree that communism is stateless and that we all want communism to happen, there are some people who don’t have very much trust in an immediate transition to communism. Those people want to preserve the state, and transition it towards communism through a series of slow reforms. They don’t trust the idea of just doing communism outright, they don’t believe in communism’s ability to fend for itself at the beginning. These careful moderates are called Stalinists, though they also like to call themselves marxist-leninists. And those of us who actually believe in the power of communism and want to do a communist revolution right away are called anarchists.
I swear it’s like Terminally Online Anarchists are in a competition to see who could say the dumbest shit possible and get downvoted the fastest. You ever heard of a transitionary state? You ever heard of scientific Marxism? You ever heard of the process? You ever thought about the fact that the USSR may have skipped quite a few steps? Right? Because you’re supposed to go from capitalism to socialism to communism. Right? Right. This is like basic shit. This is very obvious shit. Well they went from peasant class, industrialized, into communism. Right? They weren’t even industrialized when communism took place. That’s on top of western sabatage, economic pressures and beat the fucking Nazis.
The irony is that you think that a real communist, right, who wants to go from a state to a stateless society all overnight, essentially, is what you’re saying. That’s a real communist. Maybe we call them anarchists. Well, you know, the irony here is that there are anarchist derivative movements that are happening right now. You have Rojova, you have the Zapatistas. Both of these ideologies acknowledge that a state system not only is compatible with them, although (democratic confederalism would prefer there not to be a state), they even go as far as to understand that the necessity of a state, or a state-like entity, within the framework of our current global material conditions, because everything else is defined by the nation-state system. Look, I’m drunk. But I had to get on ya ass.
I keep telling people the needle has already been threaded, that anarchism and communism should no longer be opposed, modern thinkers have threaded the needle, but then I see a dumbass motherfucker like you posting and I go, well, maybe not.
Good luck abolishing the state with the West breathing down your neck. I’m sure the people you deposed will also never try and regain that power. Think ffs
The problem is that you do not know what you’re talking about. Your idea of communism is a liberal one and not one born out of material analysis.
You also do not know what “communism” and “communist” means, adding to your confusion. The first is a stage of development, it can’t be reached over night, but only via a multi generational process called socialism.
The latter is a type of socialist, a revolutionary and scientific socialist to be precise.
Being a communist does not mean that you think communism can be reached on a drop of the hat. It is someone who knows that reformism is impossible and going straight to communism also. Someone who knows that stages of development transform into each other. As such they bear the birthmarks of their origin, these can not be spelled away but have to be carefully removed over time, with the initial generation not even seeing most of the marks as such because it has been too accostomed to them.
For further reading I really recommend Lenins “State and Revolution” and Engels’ “Socialism: Utopian and Scientific”. They are not big books and enjoyable to read.
Dialectical materialism, things as a process, is the foundation of communist theory.
You can’t call yourself a communist while completely disregarding the foundation, youre obviously just an idealist. Your “immediate revolution” will only be succesful in fiction.
You’re a fucking idiot. Walking into a room filled with people who know the material you’re too lazy to look at once and explaining their own ideology to them.
I can’t begin to understand what delusions you tell about yourself that you can just intuit an entire ideology and the scientific attempts to understand history and political economy without suborning yourself to learn from the century and a half of people who came before you. Infantile.
Please, stop talking nonsense. You have no right to speak without having investigated for yourself the topic you want to speak on.
They don’t trust the idea of just doing communism outright, they don’t believe in communism’s ability to fend for itself at the beginning. These careful moderates are called Stalinists
Genuine questions.
Do you think that if Soviet Union instead immediately dissolved the state apparatus and had smaller communes (for lack of a better word) that it would have been able to defend itself from its civil wars and the imperialist nations, and moreover Nazi Germany’s war machine?
Also, what do you believe ‘Communism’ is? Or, how do you get there? Do you really think a stateless, mostly agrarian and unindustrialized land the size of a continent could just do “communism outright”?
going very boldly i see
Yep. While we can all agree that communism is stateless and that we all want communism to happen, there are some people who don’t have very much trust in an immediate transition to communism. Those people want to preserve the state, and transition it towards communism through a series of slow reforms. They don’t trust the idea of just doing communism outright, they don’t believe in communism’s ability to fend for itself at the beginning. These careful moderates are called Stalinists, though they also like to call themselves marxist-leninists. And those of us who actually believe in the power of communism and want to do a communist revolution right away are called anarchists.
I swear it’s like Terminally Online Anarchists are in a competition to see who could say the dumbest shit possible and get downvoted the fastest. You ever heard of a transitionary state? You ever heard of scientific Marxism? You ever heard of the process? You ever thought about the fact that the USSR may have skipped quite a few steps? Right? Because you’re supposed to go from capitalism to socialism to communism. Right? Right. This is like basic shit. This is very obvious shit. Well they went from peasant class, industrialized, into communism. Right? They weren’t even industrialized when communism took place. That’s on top of western sabatage, economic pressures and beat the fucking Nazis.
The irony is that you think that a real communist, right, who wants to go from a state to a stateless society all overnight, essentially, is what you’re saying. That’s a real communist. Maybe we call them anarchists. Well, you know, the irony here is that there are anarchist derivative movements that are happening right now. You have Rojova, you have the Zapatistas. Both of these ideologies acknowledge that a state system not only is compatible with them, although (democratic confederalism would prefer there not to be a state), they even go as far as to understand that the necessity of a state, or a state-like entity, within the framework of our current global material conditions, because everything else is defined by the nation-state system. Look, I’m drunk. But I had to get on ya ass.
I keep telling people the needle has already been threaded, that anarchism and communism should no longer be opposed, modern thinkers have threaded the needle, but then I see a dumbass motherfucker like you posting and I go, well, maybe not.
Good luck abolishing the state with the West breathing down your neck. I’m sure the people you deposed will also never try and regain that power. Think ffs
You misspelled “liberal”
People who want to do communist revolutions are liberals and people who don’t are the real communists. You heard it here first, folks.
The problem is that you do not know what you’re talking about. Your idea of communism is a liberal one and not one born out of material analysis.
You also do not know what “communism” and “communist” means, adding to your confusion. The first is a stage of development, it can’t be reached over night, but only via a multi generational process called socialism. The latter is a type of socialist, a revolutionary and scientific socialist to be precise.
Being a communist does not mean that you think communism can be reached on a drop of the hat. It is someone who knows that reformism is impossible and going straight to communism also. Someone who knows that stages of development transform into each other. As such they bear the birthmarks of their origin, these can not be spelled away but have to be carefully removed over time, with the initial generation not even seeing most of the marks as such because it has been too accostomed to them. For further reading I really recommend Lenins “State and Revolution” and Engels’ “Socialism: Utopian and Scientific”. They are not big books and enjoyable to read.
istg you must be trolling, there’s no way.
Dialectical materialism, things as a process, is the foundation of communist theory.
You can’t call yourself a communist while completely disregarding the foundation, youre obviously just an idealist. Your “immediate revolution” will only be succesful in fiction.
You’re a fucking idiot. Walking into a room filled with people who know the material you’re too lazy to look at once and explaining their own ideology to them.
I can’t begin to understand what delusions you tell about yourself that you can just intuit an entire ideology and the scientific attempts to understand history and political economy without suborning yourself to learn from the century and a half of people who came before you. Infantile.
Please, stop talking nonsense. You have no right to speak without having investigated for yourself the topic you want to speak on.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXUFLW8t2sntNn5jQO8vF7ai9x0fna3PV
If you can’t make yourself sit down and read, make yourself listen while driving or w/e. Just stop talking nonsense you radlib wrecker.
You’re right, but please be nice.
How do you define “state”?
that entire comment could’ve been fixed by reading like 5 pages of state and revolution.
Genuine questions.
Do you think that if Soviet Union instead immediately dissolved the state apparatus and had smaller communes (for lack of a better word) that it would have been able to defend itself from its civil wars and the imperialist nations, and moreover Nazi Germany’s war machine?
Also, what do you believe ‘Communism’ is? Or, how do you get there? Do you really think a stateless, mostly agrarian and unindustrialized land the size of a continent could just do “communism outright”?
Still curious if you could please answer my questions now that things cooled down?